Hopefully, your answer to that question was "Yes", unless you're Ghandi. And I don't think he posts here, a) because he has better things to do, b) because he's dead. If your answer was "Yes"; then that asks the question - "How vain?"

Note that when I speak of vanity, I don't mean in the sense of only physical attractiveness (though that certainly is a component, and arguably empitomises vanity). Rather, the sense of consciously experienced pride in our personal qualities and achievements. The sense that 'shallow' qualities make us better people, or people of greater worth than others. I understand that this definition is probably debatable, and feel free to do so, but not at the cost of contributing to the thread. That is, I don't want to see any posts entirely saying "Is that vanity?", if you want to use your own definition then do so - but also include what you think of vanity according to your definition.

So... we're left with questions; "How vain are you? (compared to others?)", "Is vanity part of human nature, if not, is it strongly a cultural thing?", "Is vanity a sign of insecurity?"... and so forth. Feel free to post your own questions if you like; and write what you think about vanity in yourself, in your friends, in your culture, and in your world.

Amen. Discuss. Thx.

Well, obviously the answer is yes, I'm not going to deny it, mainly in terms of being proud of one's own traits.

Funny thing is, I've always been very self-centered. An ironic plus of that is I spent many of my years in high school doing research and discovering who I was, my traits and flaws. I very much uncovered my strengths, but also uncovered my rather painful flaws, including my self-centeredness (if that is even a word). So ever since I worked that out, I've been slowly working to eliminate my flaws and increase my strengths.

I personally think you're crazy not to be proud of your positive traits, however, the key is not to be boastful or arrogant about them. I wouldn't say I'm very vain, though I used to be in my early to mid high school days, but I still take pride in my positive traits. However, nowadays I'm less "boastful" about it. But yeah, I am a little vain, but over time I'm taming my ego. Something that anyone who has always struggled with pride overkill should focus on doing.

Vanity is certainly a tough issue. As you said, what vanity is precisely is debatable.

Oh gosh yes.

Often will be the occasion when i'll throw a little flex or pec dance while walking past a mirror.

Is it because i'm insecure? I don't think so. I hardly think praising myself will bring me from the brink of happiness and realisation that i'm really a fat and ugly nerd... n-n-not that that's true of course. :P

I also pride myself in being honest, and of my ability to make people laugh.

Hell yes. I regularly boast about my terrific verbal arguing skills and superior intellect to my family, but never in an arrogant or serious way... I make it light-hearted, but obviously, this confidence in admitting it boils down to the fact I silently believe in what I'm saying.

I think everyone is vain in some way, because if you're not vain the opposite is modesty... and I cannot stand modesty, even a very small amount of it. Downplaying achievements in a public arena just irks me completely.

Vanity is a form of honesty, and I pride myself on slicing off the excess and getting right to the bone when I give my opinions... I don't hold back regardless of its effect, unless in extreme cases.

I try really hard not to be. But when my vanity shows through, I get my friends to beat me over the head with an inflatable Bunnings hammer.

I work on not having an ego. But if you think that's hard, try not being proud of not having an ego. It's even harder.

WTF did he just say?

I'm more vain about the way I look then my achievments. I'm not sure if many people find me attractive, some will and some won't. Just of recent years I have been complimented a lot about my looks and not really burnt about being ugly and it leads to my vanity. It doesn't really gain favours with most people as to them I come across as self obsessed and egocentric.

To which angle I have been labled as Metro-sexual because of my concern with how I look, and no I don't wear make up although....... NO!

I also am proud of some achievments that I've accomplished mainly in sports and that tends to lead to more boasting which once again doesn't go down well with most people, which bothers me because everyone is entitled to boast occasionally, just don't go nuts.

My ego rivals that of Elpres'. Though not that big.

Yeah ok, I'm pretty vain. But I think I manage to hide it pretty well (another thing I'm seriously awesome at :D). I certainly think that I'm pretty capable of doing anything, the trick is not saying "I could do that" until you've actually done it. Or is that just confidence in my own ability?

I've been at my new job for a whole two days and already I'm sure that I could do a better job than the guy I'm taking over from. Of course I won't be spending 3 or 4 hours chatting to people or forget that I'm filling up tanks only to have sodium hydroxide spill everywhere, so it's not really that much of a leap to think that I'll do better.

Am I vain? You tell me! YOU TELL ME!

Yes. Arrogant too. I do like to point out my achievements. Indicative of a low self-esteem? I don't know. I generally feel pretty tops about myself. If you were me you would too. :D

I am vain. Yes. I care about how I look, to the point where I've been called metrosexual, which is a bit rough simply cos I care about how I look when I go out (however I don't use much, if any hair products) and I am quite arrogant. Especially when I'm arguing (I'm quite good at it in real life, I don't care much for online arguments), when I'm arguing and I know I'm gonna win, I usually let em know. But yeah, I have had many a joke cracked about my ego...oh well. Better to be ready to back yourself and vibrant then low self esteem and quiet huddling in the corner.

Oh and I'm an absolute toss when it comes to authority. I just can't keep my mouth shut, theres been a few times where I've almost paid badly for it...

You're an arsehole.

Manny!!!! You forgot the :P DUH!!!

Didn't you know you can type anything you want, no matter how true, and no matter how mean and get away with it as long as you tack an :P on the end?

IDIOT
















:P

Sorry Moggo, but we're not having any of that shit. Let's try to keep it sane for once hey? - Civ

Moggo, for once in your bloody life, shut the hell up. Is it possible to have a thread filled with intelligent and honest discussion without you taking advantage of other people's honesty? No one gives a crap what you think of El Pres, and he did nothing wrong to warrent you being a complete and total arsehole. :rolleyes:

Now, if Moggo is willing to not ruin this awesome topic any further, let us continue...

Yes I'm fairly vain but I try not to show it. I know that I must piss people off when I do it and I know that it pisses me off when other people are vain and arrogant pricks. Sometimes I can't help but say something to make me seem vain because I just can't stand what someone else has just said.

As for my looks I realise that I'm a tall, skinny and somewhat pale skinned guy. That doesn't mean that I don't take pride in how I look though. While some people may comment on how skinny I am or whatever there are always other people whom will comment on the good things.

Sorry about starting something, which was absolutely unnecessary.

What I said, was tongue in cheek. Prez would have known that, regardless of whether I stamped a smilie in there or not.

Moggo, that was completely unnecessary. Prez did nothing to warrant that, nothing at all. Usually, you mask your insults in a flurry of other nonsense, and they generally go unnoticed, but that was just stupidly blatant.

I'll let the other mods deal with you in regards to this stupidity.

Now go to your room!

Manny, next time give us a sing you're kidding. I thought you were serious....

Can someone please let me know when this began to mimic Hyper in its completely ridiculous curbing of free-speech?

I'd rather you stuck another warning on top of my other 3 than delete my post... at least a difference of opinion could spark some regular discussion around here.

Oh well. I guess this proves that I am vain. Least I'm not off-topic.

Awwww... I wanted to hear what he said.

"ElPrez is an arrogant prick who wont give you a 5th chance after giving you 4!" :P


And Manny is an arsehole too... stupid nVidia fanboi! :D

While I personally had no qualms with keeping your post there, it was unnecessarily abusive Moggo. And that's pretty much why Civ decided to edit your post.

We've got nothing against free speech until it means that users can freely attack others.

And Prez, don't start baiting Moggo. ;)

Awwwwwwwww. But I wanna. :cry:

And Natrak tell your sig to stop poking its tongue at me. It's rude!

Manny, it would've been nice of you to post what Moggo said in the mod forum. I wanted to read it :( (oh and, it's good practice so that we can discuss whether or not an edit was justified). Either way, let's put the ugliness behind us. Or something.

I originally considered myself fairly vain, but after reading this thread I'm definetly not alone - and maybe even less vain than I thought I was. It's also interesting to see vanity described in an often positive (or at least accepting) light... I tend to think of it as uh, the root of greed and thus all evil. But I can see there's different perspectives.

I'm certainly vain when it comes to my appearance at least - which is one vain trait I can't seem to weed out. My mood each morning seems to depend alot on how good looking I feel, which doesn't seem to be related to anything. It just varies alot.

Annnyway... I'm going to open a can of worms and say that I'm less vain than most people. I'd say that I've become less vain by examining the sorts of relationships I've had with people. I found that, to weed out a 'vain tendency', all I had to do was meet people either much luckier than me or much unluckier. I used to flaunt my intelligence until I realised that one of my close friends was extremely hard-working, and still got grades which were a bit lower than mine. Afterwards, I felt wrong bragging about it, so I typically didn't (although, this process took alot longer than I'm letting on). At University I used to be quite proud of succeeding in spite of going to a crappy public school, then I met someone who came from a crappier public school and was studying a better course.

With regards possessions; I've never been a very possessive person. I spend alot of money on other people at birthdays and christmas, and I'm hesitant when buying things for myself. There's reasons for this which I won't really delve into, and don't think are important anyway. I'm not very vain at all when it comes to possessions, although like most people in this country I still take what I have for granted.

I do think I'm intelligent (in alot of ways), and I do value it in myself and other people. I do flaunt my intelligence at times but I don't do so with my degrees or University course; I've come to think that academia has much less to do with intelligence than it does hard work, a good education, a supportive environment, and a good mindset. I sort of developed this by meeting alot of 'stupid academics' at University (a friend of mine got a TER of 98, and can't make his own lunch), and also my girlfriend who is one of the smartest people I've met, yet is repeating Year 12. In truth I've come to look at my University as one which buys and sells students on the basis of prestige rather than a strong education. There's also a strong dissonance between "University intelligence" and wisdom, social intelligence, emotional intelligence, creativity, etc. In short - my marks and my degree have little bearing on how I see myself intellectually. It did take me a while to learn not to brag about my course, though.

One exception to all of this is when I see someone who I think is less intelligent than me flaunting how intelligent they are. I usually won't be able to resist the temptation of 'intellectual coup de grace', as Readman put it once. Indeed, that's one problem with arrogance - there's always the chance that you're going to meet someone who's outwardly better than you. So maybe vanity isn't inherently a sign of insecurity, but it may lead to insecurity if you meet the people who are more impressive than you.

It was Civ who edited out Moggo's post Syt ;)

Don't worry, I have the full post at work, I'll post it again tommorow.

so what, you keep all your posts backed up in case of emergency?

but yeah, as for the topic, yeah i'm vain in the sense that syt has pointed out. and yeah, in my case it's a matter of having an insecurity complex. it's something that i'm only fairly recently become aware of, and it's not fun to confront. but i'm working at it.

big ups syt for opening up an interesting can of worms.

Nah, I write my posts on MS Word so it looks as though I've been online less. They're pretty strict at times...

I'll stop interrupting this thread now. Sorry.

Yeah, that's uh...great. <_<

:P

clever! i think i might start doing that at work.

heh heh.

I'm not the sort to show off my achievements, well I guess I do when I'm around my friends. I spend a fair bit of time living in my head, analyzing myself and usually in a negative way. I find myself being with a big group and find I'm locked in my thoughts, almost thinking out a conversation before saying it or how they might take what I say. I think this is sort of part of the reason why I don't flaunt my achievements, in some ways I'm scared someone might find a reason why it's not good enough. I really admire people that genuinly can take someone putting them down and say, "Hey, I don't care what they think anyway". I think a lot of teenagers go though a period of in some way discovering themselves.

In the end I know why I act like this, because I'm insecure within myself. I have some friends that often treat me like shit. Infact I know I really need to find some new friends... Smoking errr illegal substances can end you up with a certain type of friends. Often the kind that don't like the way their lives are going and they put you down to make them feel better. But I guess in the end you have to realize how short life is and ask yourself what you truely want from and take that. When I ask myself I would say happiness within who I am and whatever I do, after telling yourself this it makes it easier to discover what you need to do to achieve that goal.

I rather El Presidente to Moggo, as Moggo seems to be a cock :dance3: Why you bagging Kami, too, Moggo?

Some days I'm vain, some days I couldn't give a shit. Throughout high school I didn't care about my looks at all. However, when I first came to uni I didn't really meet people straight off, so I gradually got more paranoid (vain) about my looks. Now, however, I don't really care.

I've got no real reason to be confident, as I'm not really that good at anything.

Hear, hear, old chum!

Seems? Not too bad. Difference is, we know ElPresidente is.

And I bag Kami because he's an absolute plonker.

Actually it is Cocks with an s. :D

Me too man, me too. I'm not at all vain about my appearance, since I'm not much to look at anyway, I don't bother trying to look my best. Back in high school things were different, I kept up with fashion and tried to look my best, but I was more doing it for the sake of other people and for acceptance, rather than doing it for myself. After school I though nuts to that, I'm relatively comfortable with who I am, so now I dress and look how I want to.

As for showing off achievements and whatnot, I am quite proud of my (few) academic and sporting achievements, but since I can't stand show offs myself, I do my best to not gloat over them. Say, did I ever mention I finished at the top of my year 11 History class? :P I have a friend who kicks arse at drawing comic book style stuff, but he always has to show off his portfolio to every single person he meets and he has to show me every new drawing of his. Smarmy bastard.

I've gotten to the point where I don't even really like talking about myself to my mates and family. Somebody will ask me how work's going and I'll say, "Good", and that'll be it. However, when I ask somebody else, for example, about work they'll talk for many minutes, and I'll just keep on asking questions. I don't really know why I do it...
I wonder if anybody's actually noticed that I only answer questions about myself with one word?

Question - do you like hearing about other people's day-to-day lives?

I personally can't stand to talk about my own daily life, nor can I stand to hear about anybody elses. Frankly, I find it all very boring, ineffectual, and repetitive. It's nice being on Holidays, because the last few weeks all I've heard from people at Uni is "Wow! Exams are the suck! I haven't studied wow! Isn't this a fascinating exchange of ideas and thoughts?!"

I'm the same in that I hate talking about such inconsequential bollocks as what goes on in my daily life but there are people out there who do give a damn.

I lost a girlfriend largely due to this inability to talk about the mundane aspects of the simple art of living. My gf at the time, lets call her Miss Leggz (she was 6 foot 3 inches... it all makes sense now ;)) would always go on and on about the dull stuff in her life and I honestly did enjoy listening to it. I loved the girl to death, if she took six steps to get up the stairs instead of seven I was fascinated.

Turns out her interest in my life was equal to mine in hers but I simply didn't see the appeal and would not talk about what went on from day to day if nothing significant happened.

In the end we broke up and one of the cited reasons was that she felt shut out, she admitted I was easily the most affectionate of the two of us but despite my emotional openess with her, there was no practical openess and it drove her insane.

No real point to make here outside of the fact that despite you finding your own life boring (in terms of being interesting enough to tell other people about) the people who care about you might feel different.

I'd love to say I learnt a lesson from all of that, but I didn't. :P

Live and don't learn. That's me alright :P

Moggo will tell you, i love myself :D
But it probably all comes down to the fact that i'm insecure..

I tend to agree Syt, although I'd say it is basically say it depends upon who you associate with. I used to love returning to school after holidays purely because of the friends I had and the fact they always had something exciting or hilarous to tell me. But then there are also those who talk about nothing else aside from the same old things, which is just darn boring after the tenth time of hearing it.

I know someone who is like that except ten times worse. Once something happens that involves him you won't stop hearing about it even two years down the track. No joke. The guy gives me and everyone else the shits :lol:

I can't really talk about day to day stuff very well. I usually answer with a couple of words. "How was work tonight?" "Alright" "What was the exam like?" "Hard" I much prefer to talk about entertaining things and cut the small talk.